Banner of Devastation Bike Lists

Ok, so check this list that just won the TSHFT Open.  What the hell does TSHFT stand for?  I couldn't find out on the tournament website.   Tournament Seattle Homeboy Fruitbooty Tournament?  Sure.

• HQ – Sammael – Raven Sword, Adamantite Mantle, Corvex, Night Halo.
• HQ – Librarian – Mastery Level 2, Auspex, Space Marine Bike, Force Staff, Psychic Hood.
• HQ* – Ravenwing Command Squad – 3x – 2 Corvus Hammer, 2 Plasma Talons, Champion w/ Blade of Caliban, Apothecary w/ Narthecium, Standard Bearer w/ Banner of Devastation & Grenade Launcher.
• Troops – Ravenwing Attack Squad – 6x + 1x Atk Bike – 2 Plasmaguns, Multimelta.
• Troops – Ravenwing Attack Squad – 6x + 1x Atk Bike – 2 Flamers, Multimelta.
• Troops – Ravenwing Attack Squad – 6x + 1x Atk Bike – 2 Meltaguns, Multimelta.
• Troops – Ravenwing Attack Squad – 6x + 1x Atk Bike – 2 Meltaguns, Multimelta.
• Troops – Ravenwing Attack Squad – 6x + 1x Atk Bike – 2 Meltaguns, Multimelta.
• Fast Att – Ravenwing Black Knights – 5x – 4 Plasma Talons, Power Sword, 1 Grenade Launcher.

Wow, so you got like 45 models, all with T5, 3+ and 5+ cover.  Tons of anti-armor.  Tons of anti-personnel. psychic powers, debuffs, and it's fast.  At first I was wondering where the anti-air was, and then I counted up all the meltaguns and realized there's plenty.  The Banner of Devastation makes it all go, but it's pretty solid even without it.  Sammael would ride with the Command Squad to give them three extra EW wounds protecting the banner.  You might see variations with a Dark Shroud, as well.

If you read the battle reports, you'll see that he was able to absolutely blow his opponent's army away at an hilarious rate in every game but the last, which he still won handily.  Let's do some math.  Each bike squad is sporting seven twin-linked bolters that are Salvo 4.  That is 140 twin-linked S4 shots per turn.  That works out to 125 hits, 62 wounds on Screamers or Flamers, 28 of which go unsaved, even if Fateweaver is around.

In other words, this list is a "you lose" button.  With a flyer supplement about to come out and nerf Night Scythes, this list just jumped to the top of your "I's Afeared Of It" list.

If you can somehow destroy the banner first turn, the list becomes manageable, but still powerful enough to be dangerous.  If you field three squads of six Flamers like I do, two will come in the first wave if I get what I want.  I have to hope the deep strikes go well, but I doubt a smart opponent will leave his banner anything other than totally bubble-wrapped.  Especially since they get a scout move to get into better position.

Honestly, I don't have any good idea how to beat an intelligent opponent running this list with Daemons.  The army is too squishy to deal with it.  If Fatecrusher was a cavalry list, that could maybe do it, but as it is, it would just get shot up slowly as the bikes play keep away.  I briefly thought a Flying Circus might be able to do it, but the bikes could easily block all the swooping lanes, forcing the MCs to land.  Once on the ground, they are through.  If I were running this bike list, I would beat Daemons every single time in a laugher.  It's not that I'm that damn good, it's that I don't have to be because I have 140 twin-linked shots on bikes, asshole!  Oh, and if I go first, I'm using my scout move, first turn move and turboboost to clog the board and force you to drop where I want you.  Good luck, asshole!

So we ask ourselves, what does this army fear that Chaos armies can field?  Heldrakes are the clear answer since they have no defense against it.  Blastmasters can also cause problems.  Flamers can take out one squad at a time.  Large AP3 or better blasts are good.  Mass plasma would scare it, but Chaos doesn't really do the plasma thing that well.  Screamers are ok if they can get the charge, and still terrific against most other armies.  That's about it.

That gives us Noise Marines, Flamers, Vindicators, Soul Grinders, Defilers (LOLWTFJK), Heldrakes, Obliterators (210 points for three plasma cannons every other turn???!  That won't cut it.) and Plasma Forgefiends (Har!) to work with.  So, um, Noise Marines, Flamers, Vindicators and Heldrakes, you say?  How dull...  Good thing I like all those models.

Noise Marines aren't as useful against this army as you'd think because if you field them on foot, they're dead.  If you put them in a Rhino, you have to keep the Rhino on the move to stay away from all the melta, or they're dead.  The Blastmaster is only going to kill two bikes per turn on a good day anyway.  We can get similar results with a plasma gun for much less.  However, the Blastmaster has its uses against other armies, so it's not a total waste.

Chaos Lord, Burning Brand of Skalathrax

4x5 Chaos Space Marines, Plasma Gun, Rhino, Havoc Launcher

2 Vindicators, Daemonic Possession, Siege Shield

3 Heldrakes, Baleflamers

Aegis Defense Line, Comm Relay

Tzeentch Herald

6 Flamers

9 Screamers

5 Daemonettes

1996

That's the best I've come up with at this early stage.  Two Vindicators might be too many, but maybe not.  They say you need to field two Vindies to get one.  Victory is not guaranteed, but it can win.  The list has a major weakness in that only the Vindicators and the Screamers are credible anti-tank.  I just don't have any more room to squeeze stuff in.  I'll refine it with time, however, the major problem with beating that bike list is that it has a scout move on top of its tons of bolter shots, and mass melta, so it can get those multi-meltas into 12" range on turn 1 if they go first.  Or, they can choose to outflank you depending on the scenario and how you deploy.  Your only trump card is the Heldrakes.

As your you Daemon purists out there.  Take Soul Grinders with Phlegm and hope you take out the banner quickly.  Then you may have a shot.  

Fateweaver

3x5 Daemonettes

5 Plaguebearers

6 Flamers

2x5 Flamers

3x6 Screamers

2x Soul Grinder, Phlegm

Daemon Prince, Mark of Tzeentch, Bolt, MoS, Breath, Flight

1996 

You probably won't win, but you theoretically could if you go first.  Perhaps when the new codex is released, Daemons will get new power combos that can take this on.  Later, fruitbooties.